Let us assume you are a time traveller. I do not see any viable way for you to return to your own time line then. I say this because that you mentioned the difficulty with time travel in the sense of divergences. You said that you travelled back in time from 2036 to 1975 with a ~1-2% divergence. You also mentioned that in your time frame a 0% divergence is sort of a myth, i.e technologically improbable. Now if I understand your plan, you say you will once again travel back to 1975 before you arrived and then go forward as to avoid going into the future of our time line, which by your presence here would be an alternate future from your own. But what I would ask is, if you plan to go back to 1975 from 2000, you should incur a certain non-zero percent divergence just as you did going from 2036 to 1975. I would surmize that it is impossible or technologically improbable for you to go back to the exact world line you departed from then. Even if you are able to travel back with a 0% divergence, which by your previous words would be mythological, what would ensure you that the future you travelled into was exactly the world line you left. Since there are an infinite number of possible world lines departing from 1975 into the future. I suppose the key point of this argument is that any trip through time with your technology would result in a non-zero divergence, and in order for you to arrive in your own world line you must create a 0% divergent trip. This is amusing in the sense that the harder you try to get to your own world line the more divergences you incur and hence the furthur away you get. I believe I see the birth of a new temporal paradox.
Greetings everyone. I’ve been away for a while so I apologize for not getting back to these questions sooner. Since Trott brought up a few things I had addressed in the mysterious mail that never made it to the board…I will post it here. The others are responses from other questions.
((First, where does your interest in the (our) U.S. Constitution stem from? Why do you think it is so vital for us to read and understand it?))
After the war, the United States had split into five separate regions based on the various factors and military objectives they each had. There was a great deal of anger directed toward the Federal government and a revival of states rights was becoming paramount. However, in their attempt to create an economic form of government, the political and military leaders at the time decided to hold one last Constitutional Congress in order to present a psychological cohesion from the old system. During this Congress, the leaders discovered and decided that coming up with a new and better form of government was nearly impossible. The original Constitution itself was not the problem it was the ignorance of the people that lived under it.
((Second, do you not like your "new" Constitution? Or feel that it is not as effective as the original?))
From my viewpoint, it’s very effective. I am a very strong believer in local or state’s rights.
((Third, you keep saying that you will be going back to your worldline soon, how soon will this be?))
There are certain windows I must wait for in order to leave. There will be two this year. The first one opens this spring.
((Is it physically possible for you to get back to THIS time line once you leave?))
Not with the machine I have now.
((If all 7 Billion of us here each had our own time machine do you think that would we would end up trashing the rest of the local worldlines?))
Since everything is already happening and possible on different worldlines, the answer is yes….and no.
((Correct me if I'm wrong here but I see you as a Libertarian who expounds on the need for humanity to get back to certain basics. Like the issues defined by the Constitution and your comments earlier on firearms tend to make me believe you are a Gun Rights activist.))
I suppose from your vantage point that’s a fair assessment. I would call myself more of a centrist. Although I understand the “gun rights” issue here, I cannot relate to it all and it is a common point of argument with my mother. I keep saying her tune will change in about ten years and she’ll be cleaning shotguns in her sleep but it doesn’t help. If it makes you feel any better, I never shot anyone who wasn’t trying to kill me.
((could you give us your thoughts on how us "less enlightened" ones here in this worldline of the here/now can solve the technical problems of time travel so that we may be able to enjoy the same first hand knowledge you have that gives you these social insights?))
When you say “us”, what do you mean? Do you mean “you”? Where would you go if you had my machine? How do you think the rest of the world would react to the U.S. having a time machine and they didn’t?
((You said that you traveled back in time from 2036 to 1975 with a ~1-2% divergence. You also mentioned that in your time frame a 0% divergence is sort of a myth, i.e technologically improbable.))
Yes, a “ZD” is thought to be impossible. However, consider that an exact entry point “may” not be necessary to get home. The important factor is the path, not the destination. Under multiple world theory, there are an infinite number of “homes” that I could return to that don’t have me there. The divergence for that window is somewhere near .0002377%.
((Someone correct me where I'm wrong here but as I understand it, these Parallel Universes or Alternative Timelines are "created" by events in our own, (timelines) or even in others.))
Parallel universes exist independently of each other and only interact to avoid the collapse of the wave function for any given particle or event that you are looking at. I like to imagine it as a series of parallel lines crossed by a wavy wave. Each point on the wavy line where a straight line crosses it represents an alternate outcome. The multiple “yous” on each worldline record a different result for the activity of the particle.
((Actually, in science, "Multiverse" theory is something that has NEVER been proven. For lack of evidence. It crops up from time to time as a way to explain certain SEEMING paradoxes like the EPR double slit experiment with polarized light. But then, just because it can be used to explain something doesn't mean it is so.))
I agree with you that an explanation doesn’t make it so. However you can build a model to describe physical behavior. Even if the model is not complete, its “truth” can be measured by how well it predicts the behavior it describes.
((So help me here. Where did multiverse come from as a theory? Where is the observable evidence of it's existence and the experiments to back it up that can be duplicated with certainty and repitition?))
I believe the closest non-related evidence for multiple universes right now comes from the physics (derived from special relativity) of rotating (Kerr) black holes. If you examine a typical Penrose map, science agrees that you can travel to “other universes” through these cosmic oddities. They can’t be different places in your own universe (worldline) because you would have to violate the speed of light limit to get there.
Since the existence of multiple universes is a reality from my viewpoint, please allow me to disclose an idea we toss around a bit in 2036. Since all possibilities, outcomes and events are occurring and exist simultaneously, it would mean there are multiple universes out there where “you” are living a day behind and a day ahead of the “you” on this universe.
There are some who believe that memory is some sort of information transfer or communication with the “yous” in the past, across worldlines or universes. Although this is seemingly quite ridiculous, if you think that could be true, than physics tells us that the same information transfer from our future selves on other worldlines is not only possible but certain. Could it be that fantasy or “what if” scenarios are actually future memory from an alternate “us” on a future worldline?
According to physics, there is no reason why this cannot be true although I probably fall a little closer to DiViper’s feelings about this as he does on multiple universes.
good! I see you were finally able to post your posting. I think there was something wrong with the 11th page. I was there a couple of times and it was just blank.
you could click on it and it went to the 11th page but there was nothing there.
Hi TTO, you must be on right now! because your last post above me was not there when I posted! so we have solved the 11th page mystery! your right I tested it again and it accepts my post but then it disappears and does not show up on the page at all.it went interdimensional and is posted on some other world lines page! hahaahah
where does it say it is limited to 11 pages though...I don't see it.??....wait a minute...you are not looking at the third open folder at the top of the page are you?
....YOU posted that! hehehe
((Yes, a 'ZD' is thought to be impossible. However, consider that an exact entry point 'may' not be necessary to get home. The important factor is the path, not the destination. Under multiple world theory, there are an infinite number of 'homes' that I could return to that don't have me there. The divergence for that window is somewhere near .0002377%. ))
Well, that being said, you have clearly stated you will never return to the EXACT universe you departed from. In otherwords, the universe which supposedly required your assistance to bring them a 5100 IBM computer from the past. That society will never receive the computer, your true parents will never see you again, etc... So, it would seem to me that your "mission" to go back in time to help your society in the future seems rather illogical, because in fact you can not help them without the ability to make, what you termed a "ZD", a zero divergence trip. It just seems pointless to me to return to an alternate timeline when your mission was desired or required on your own timeline.
If I understand TT_0 properly (which, I'm afraid, may be debatable)and if I may be so presumptuous as to risk an idea based on Trott's question to test my understanding:
If the potential divergens is approximately .00024%, then the difference between "adjacent" worldlines has the highest probability to be negligible.
Assuming that, then a TT_0 from "the next worldline over" is likely to have left to go on a similar mission and will return to "the original" TT_0's worldline.
That is, the TT_0 we've obviously found so stimulating will return to a different worldline, surely, but it would be so similar to his own, it might as well be his original.
Similarly, a TT_0 ("not ours") will return from a worldline similar to our own to "our TT_0's" worldline and be such a perfect doppleganger that the "originating" worldline recieves the IBM, and his Mom never knows the difference.
((So, it would seem to me that your "mission" to go back in time to help your society in the future seems rather illogical, because in fact you can not help them without the ability to make, what you termed a "ZD", a zero divergence trip.))
The reality of infinite possibilities is rather difficult to get a grip on and if it were not for the math, I would delegate it to the realm of religion. I like to think of it as standing in a room with mirrors on all the walls. I can look to my right and left and see many “mes” all doing exactly the same thing. If we all took a step to our right and passed through a dimensional doorway to the next mirrored room, it would be very difficult to tell if anything had changed. In that sense, there are an infinite number of worldlines waiting for me to return with the computer. If I can get to one of them, I have completed my mission.
((Similarly, a TT_0 ("not ours") will return from a worldline similar to our own to "our TT_0's" worldline and be such a perfect doppleganger that the "originating" worldline recieves the IBM, and his Mom never knows the difference.))
Bingo!! Seems like something they would do a lot of psychological testing for before they sent us off.
I wasnt aware that the postings had numbers. you didnt go back and count all 412 posts did you? this is the last post I see on MY computer......copied and pasted:
(I wonder if everyone else has the same thing.is this the last one you have too?)
unregistered posted 26 January 2001 12:55
What happened to Pamala and TT_O? They both dropped off the board at the same time.
PC crash, hanky panky?
maybe the Mighty Moderators will check into it. Mop will get to the bottom of it. he'll be able to tell us what is happening to mysterious page 11!
TTO- check your email I sent you something!
That is interesting what you said about parallel universes having a time delay. Infact just a couple of days ago I came up with a very similar conclusion.
I believe that all mass quantities have both a linear fourth dimensional past and a transverse fourth dimensional past. The parallel masses are masses existant in the parallel time frames.
I believe that an instant of time in the parallel universe<or> a 'transverse' instant that is in phase with any given instant in this universe is exactly or approxametly one instant in the past with respect to the instant in this universe and would appear (and I could be wrong about this assumption) to exist within the same given space as negative one instant in this world line<or> one 'linear' instant in the past.
However if we were viewing the travsverse instant from the position of the linear instant--that is--if we were to view the parallel instant from one instant back in time, then the transverse instant would not appear to coexist in the same space as our the instant that we occupy but, instead,
would apear to propagate perpindicalar-or-would be perpindicular to our position. This is all hypthetical not theoretical.
I leave you with this graghical model for review. if one were to trace all linear instants along their past world lines to the bigbang, and if one were to trace all transverse time instants back to the big bang, and then gragh these events, one would discover that all transverse time instants are ninety degrees out of phase with the linear time instants.
I believe that one would also discover that these time instants travel outward in the form of temperal waves and that the bandwidth of these of both the transverse time instants and linear<or> parallel time instant's bandwidth streches as time accelerates into the future as though time were exploding into an expance.
I believe that the rate at which transverse and linears instant's bandwidth increases simultaneous and equal so that the phase differencial between all linear instants and thier parallel counterparts the transverse instants has always been constant from the big bang till now. At the big bang all linear instants and all transverse instants merge.
Think or write the following graph to replicate the mathematical logic behind this phenomenon. Get a pieve of paper and draw a right triangle. Make it so that the horizontal line points to 3 O'clock and the vertical line points to 12 O'clock. Now take the ruler or what ever straight object you used to draw the triangle and draw a diagonal line from the intersection of the vertical line and horizontal line to 2 O'clock. Now I want you to measure the length of the vertical line and then divide the length into quarters and place a small mark on the vertical lines at each of the quarters. Now I want you to draw four parallel lines through the four marks on the vertical line, such that there is one line through each one of the four marks on the vertical line of our triangle. Make sure that the four lines are horizontal with respect to the line that marks the base of our right triangle. Now I want you to goe back and make sure that the diagonal line that you drew is long enough to intersect each of the four parallel lines you drew. Now the parallel lines on the graph are time instants 1-4. The vertical and horizontal line is a the measure of a mass in three dimensional space. Now you will notice that each of the four vertical lines instants 1-4 intersect the diagonal line at the 1/3 mark so that each parallel time line 1-4 is always divided at the 2/3rds mark.
Yet if one looks closely enough one will notice that the vertical line of our triangle, the diagonal that we drew, and the base of our triangle all intersect at a point.
Thus 2/3rds and 1/3rd are equal quantities at an infinitely small point. If the parallel time instants follows after this mathematical topology then the transverse instants and thier parallel counterparts all exist out of phase thoughout history accept at the exact instant of the big bang.
Thus if one can triangulate the temperal location of the big bang while in time warp the ship could travel through temperal space to into the big bang and use the big bang to as sort of an infinite amplifier to solidify the and or isolate the location of ones exact world line and thus travel through time with zero divergance.
please allow me to disclose an idea we toss around a bit in 2036. Since all possibilities, outcomes and events are occurring and exist simultaneously, it would mean there are multiple universes out there where 'you' are living a day behind and a day ahead of the 'you' on this universe.
There are some who believe that memory is some sort of information transfer or communication with the 'yous' in the past, across worldlines or universes. Although this is seemingly quite ridiculous, if you think that could be true, than physics tells us that the same information transfer from our future selves on other worldlines is not only possible but certain.
If you could occassionally communicate with the you's from different world lines (day ahead)(day behind) would this explain the common dejavu people seem to have at times?
the definition of dejavu is as follows "which is described as the illusion of having previously experienced something actually being encountered for the first time"
hmmm...this is very interesting indeed.
If this be true it could explain alot of other things as well such as an unexplained bad feeling or fear of not getting on a plane that you find out later crashes.
Is it possible to recieve messages from other world lines? if so how is it done?
how do you pick up on such a thing? or is this something all together different. we have all heard the stories of things like this happening but often times there are no explainations.
<This message has been edited by pamela (edited 27 January 2001).>
Ok just for the fun of it let me add to the confusion by submitting another theory. I THE GREAT SHADOW CAN CONTROLL THE CREATION OF ALTERNATE WORLD LINES! How?
I sit down at the kitchen table and slide my coffee cup to the left one foot. A second world line is created that is exactly the same as the first ......except the cup is in a different spot. Both lines are so similar and close in time and space that the miraculous event goes un-noticed and un-applauded.
Every event and object of a parallel world that does NOT differ from our present one IS the present one and is shared over time and space, with all the alternates. Only the differences would be detectable and those differences would be by definition elsewhere. We could have "parallel" worlds by the zillions glued so tight together as to be "too close to see".
In other words when I move the cup over to the left I am just moving the cup to the left and not moving the rest of the universe over to the right as is suggested in the multi universe therory.
Your idea certainly seems to be a plausible hypothesis.
I may be oversimplifying the matter (or have missed a major point entirely), but I can't help but wondering about the physical ramifications of being even temporally present at the big bang.
That is, wouldn't being there at the time of the mother of all explosions be a little difficult to survive?
Let me change gears in this post to present a slightly oddball idea:
I truly like the idea of slight temporal differences between worldlines. If we take this concept a step further, and looked further across (as opposed to "down") the worldlines, we may see greater differences in time. That is one worldline at our reference time 2:00pm would be at 3:00pm at another worldline further across this array of worldlines. The further across, the greater the temporal difference.
That being said, we can state that all times exist simultaneously. Therefore, time travel need not be a linear event, but rather a "skipping over" of worldlines. Of course, it can be agued that this would not be a genuine form of time travel, merely an illusory one.
So...how could this be accomplished, folks? Any ideas?
I'm guessing a singularity of some sort may still be required. However, I think Pamela and others may have really hit upon something with their ideas of deja-vu and other phenomenon. Maybe it's a bit easier than I've been thinking.
Just to add to the recent theory on DjÃ vu. I have about on an average day 5 deja vu experiences. Accompanied by visions, and manifestations. Wherever I go, I know in my mind that I have been there before. Whoever I meet, I know that I have met them before somewhere, or some time. Although as a child they were much more frequent, the intensity has since gone up from the last 2 years.
I created a theory for this phenomena, which I called 'Temporal Networking and its Mechanics.' However, it wasn't to my satisfaction, so I decided on taking it down from my website. It's hard for me to describe what I am feeling, and even more since I am not a scientist. However, I feel like each day that passes, I come closer to understanding this feeling, and my place in this world.
"For what was, for what is, and for what will be. I will fight for it's preservation."
So tell us, what was the real reason you were away from this board for so long? Was it to fine tune your responses to the questions that were being asked while away? They seem pretty well thought out, you sure you didn't have help? Your character speaks more like a writer, then a Time Traveler.
I still don't buy your story though, just the whole way you've come forward with it, just doesn't feel right to me. And you never showed us a picture of your machine or your uniform. Let's see your credentials, something we can bring out in the open. That way, you can free everyone from doubt, and everyone will believe your story.
Seems only fair, and you'd have everyone's unconditional attention. Which is, what I'm sure it's what you want. You said it your self, you want to be interestingâ€¦
And since where bringing up things said in the past, why haven't you commented on what you said about not caring about your worldline? I know someone made the mistake of answering for you, but I don't think that will happen again.
Enforcer of Time,
The more I read your postings the more I am beginning to think of the possibility of something being terribly wrong with your time lines. I've been thinking deeply on the the statement you have made:
(((Just to add to the recent theory on DjÃ vu. I have about on an average day 5 deja vu experiences. Accompanied by visions, and manifestations. Wherever I go, I know in my mind that I have been there before. Whoever I meet, I know that I have met them before somewhere, or some time. Although as a child they were much more frequent, the intensity has since gone up from the last 2 years.)))
and with the new knowledge I am gaining daily. you seem to be having a "bleedover"
between timelines. at first I thought something had happened to you as a child to cause this severe distortion. some kind of severe trauma. but now I am beginning to wonder about the possibility of time interfereance. here is an interesting question: what would happen to an individual that was interferred with over and over and over? would the time lines eventually break down and cause bleedthrough to other timelines? this is very interesting to think about.
I was talking to a man that was involved in the Montauk project (atleast he said he was,it is hard to find out the truth about all things)
and one interesting thing he was telling me is he was hooked to the projects with some of his essence. I will not reveal too much of what he said but it is interesting that he said in the Montauk area he had noticed that because the area was, how can I say,
so "messed with" in the area of time distortion that the whole area had many bleedthroughs and astrally they were seen as images of different stages such as a tree that was there. could be viewed as tree stump and then superimposed over that image was one of a young tree and also an average tree.
the area had been literally ripped apart sortof speak and many "times" were (Im not sure if this is the right word) "overlapping" in different areas.
I thought this was very interesting. not that I believe it all but I do keep it all in mind. because it is interesting what you can relate it to later.
Trott has made a very good point there. If you leave your worldline, some of your friends and familymembers will never see you again on that worldline. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that would be a very immoral thing to do.
Besides what's the point of fixing the Unix problem if there's an infinite number of worldlines where this problem doesn't even exist or has been fixed. After all your own worldline doesn't get the IBM 5100 anyway, so the people that sent you on this mission are still having that problem.
Also, you stated that "to the people on your worldline you'd only be gone for a split second". This can't be true, because to them you'll go away and never return.
Oh, I seem to have missed another statement by Trott saying that another "Timetravel_0" will return to the worldline, but that sounds virtually impossible!
Timetravel_0 stated clearly that returning to your own worldline is thought to be impossible. Besides if something like that were to happen, it's very improbable that it would happen to the worldline that Timetravel_0 originated from.
Consequently, Timetravel_0's friends and family are left alone and will never see Timetravel_0 again, which sounds very cruel to me. I hope you said goodbye to them Timetravel_0. At least you won't notice.
One of the reasons I like this board so much is that the questions are more thought out, the people seem to be a bit smarter than normal and I'm not continually bombarded with questions about stock tips. I will admit that on a conceptual level, you are picking it up much faster than I did.
(If you leave your worldline, some of your friends and family members will never see you again on that worldline. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that would be a very immoral thing to do.)
I'm not sure why you think it would be immoral. Don't soldiers today go on duties they may not return from?
It depends on how you define what the real 'me' is. If you consider the mirror example again, as all of the 'mes' step one room to the right, the family and friends in that room (and the time traveler for that matter) would not be able to tell the difference. The probability of us noticing a difference is based on the divergence of the trip. If all events and outcomes are certain, there are worldlines where I do return for every worldline I don't return to. All the 'moral' events would then balance out to zero. Again, it's hard to judge good and bad outcomesâ€¦only good and bad decisions.
((Besides what's the point of fixing the Unix problem if there's an infinite number of worldlines where this problem doesn't even exist or has been fixed. After all your own worldline doesn't get the IBM 5100 anyway, so the people that sent you on this mission are still having that problem.))
Our actions and decisions are based on the knowledge we have in our own worldline. Yes, the bell shaped curve is a useful tool but if we are capable of change for the better than we feel we should at least try.
Even if 'I' don't return to my exact worldline, a similar 'me' probably will. Besides, I just look at it as helping a worldline where their time traveling me didn't show up but I did.
((Also, you stated that "to the people on your worldline you'd only be gone for a split second". This can't be true, because to them you'll go away and never return.))
Again, I refer to the mirror example.
((Oh, I seem to have missed another statement by Trott saying that another "Timetravel_0" will return to the worldline, but that sounds virtually impossible!))
I'm not sure I said another time traveler 'will' return, I think I said they 'could' return. The location/gravity 'map' I have of my path getting here could be duplicated with a fairly high degree of accuracy. It's just that my machine was not designed to do that.
I think it's a mistake to rely on the concept of the impossible when dealing with the reality of multiple worlds. Keep in mind there are an infinite number of 'yous' on infinite worldlines having completely different experiences with 'me'.
((Timetravel_0 stated clearly that returning to your own worldline is thought to be impossible.))
Questions for time travel _0. Are the Olympics still being played in your time? You said that you're the VGL system records your trip, would it not be possible to use that recording to back track to your original starting point without any divergence at all? It seems that all it would take it is a couple lines of programming in the computer-controlled system. It would just make your trip a little longer and be more computer intensive. Or is this what the system does and because of the clocks you use, you can only get so close to you're original world line. Have you ever read the book Six Nightmares by Anthony Lake? Why only two windows of opportunity for you to start your time machine? Would this have something to do with the weather?
Again, I do not have enough knowledge to completely understand all the consequences of multiple worldlines. And it is not my intention to prove or disprove that you're a timetraveler, I just enjoy exploring all the possiblilties.
I see your point now. Another "you" that traveled back in time from another worldline, might end up going back to the worldline of which you originated, because of the divergance. However there's still a big chance that Copy_of_Timetravel_0 will not return to your ZD worldline and thus leaving your friends and family without a copy of you.
You mentioned that the same goes for soldiers in our worldline. Yes, true. But do you not disaprove of war, just like me? I think it's immoral so I stand with my previous statement.
Also, wanting to make things better is not a bad thing, but what's the use of bringing back an IBM 5100 to a slightly different worldline, knowing that there are just as many or even more worldlines in which no-one returns to bring back the IBM 5100. It sounds a bit like charity in favour of other worldlines.
Okay TT_O, I got to admit your device looks familiar to me. However, I doubt you can Time Travel with that. Looks like something you put together with old radio equipment from your garage, more like it.
I used to play with stuff like this when I was 1 year old, so maybe that's why it looks familiar to me.
Nevertheless, there is no way, that that device could have gotten you here from almost 40 years into the future. That's just to rich... =) Lol.
So you think everyone who meets you should automatically find something to like about you? Man, how arrogant can someone be? Unlike you, I don't strive to be liked, and I don't ask people to believe me when I post scientific explanations to back up my story of being a Time Traveler.
You came to this board claiming to be a Time Traveler. No one should go unquestioned of their motives if say they are. You can be as articulate with your words as much as you want. And it may convince some that you are who you claim to be. However, the fact of the matter still remains, all I did was ask the questions no one was asking. So please forgive me for being a Time Travel Activist with morals.
Probably because of the confusion of the board, you have not yet commented to my post directed toward you. I'm very interested in your further comments on the greed of humanity during this time, and perhaps still in your time.
<[having lived through the self destruction of the human race, what sort of future do you imagine after 2036? Will humans colonolize and expand through the solar system? Or will we be forever bound to our inward existance, measuring the past, fearfull of the future.>]
You're unique perspective of humanity at this point (2001 and 2036) is valuable. Please share as much thoughts as you can.
Also, can you record a quick voice message for us before you leave?
((having lived through the self destruction of the human race, what sort of future do you imagine after 2036? Will humans colonolize and expand through the solar system? Or will we be forever bound to our inward existance, measuring the past, fearfull of the future.))
What I like about TT_0 is his adherence to "character". Meaning that this is first and foremost a board devoted to Time Travel which at this point in our human history is pure fiction.
Even the moderators and creators of this board are careful to point that out right on the home page at the bottom. Lest we forget.
So... having said that, I must admit TT_0 has woven a personna that is rather well crafted in my opinion. In other words, I take him as he prefers to be referenced to. It's a "camp" thing. A Tongue-in-cheek kinda process.
I find his philosphical dissertations to be interesting, and for the most part, reflective of an idealism that indicate what shape he would LIKE to see the world BE in in 40 years. With a dose of caution thrown in for what he sees as possible threats to further enlightenment, and the erosion of personal freedoms that are occuring around us on an almost daily basis. Actually quite creative on his part if we take it all with the grain of salt that is apropos to the situation.
In the end, if Time Travel is to be solved, is it not goung to take creative thought to do it?
We've beaten the old concepts to death on this board for a few years now.
I merely suggest that ANY approach to the problem that deviates from these old concepts is a creative and therefore productive one.
If TT_0 wants to assume the role of futirist-as-time-traveller, I say OK. But then I'm a pragmatic sort of guy who is into the sceptism of "show me the money" mentality.
Is it possible to show how some of his mechanics cannot possibly be true? Of Course.
But is it possible to show how his philosophical approach is flawed? Well, that becomes another problem entirely. Not one so easy to dismiss.
((Are the Olympics still being played in your time?))
As a result of the many conflicts, no, there were no official Olympics after 2004. However, it appears they may be revived in in 2040.
((would it not be possible to use that recording to back track to your original starting point without any divergence at all? It seems that all it would take it is a couple lines of programming in the computer-controlled system))
Perhaps it's better to say it's so highly improbable as to be considered impossible. A good example is the concept of trying to get closer to something by cutting the distance in half for every step you take. Since the computer is basically making calculations from an imperfect model of reality, there are no absolutes. I also believe there is a theory that states you would have to violate the speed of light limit to have a perfect ZD.
((Have you ever read the book Six Nightmares by Anthony Lake? Why only two windows of opportunity for you to start your time machine? Would this have something to do with the weather?))
I haven't read that book but I will try to find it if you recommend it. The weather isn't a factor as much as gravitational tidal forces are at the point of arrival.
((You mentioned that the same goes for soldiers in our worldline. Yes, true. But do you not disaprove of war, just like me? I think it's immoral so I stand with my previous statement.))
I disapprove of murder. Man as a species is incapable of changing his nature through will alone and war is a tool of biology. The ability for war sleeps in each one of us and we must decide what we will do before the beast awakens. As for morality, again I point to the 'universal' balance of good and evil. For every worldline where there is peace, there is a worldline that has destroyed itself.
((what's the use of bringing back an IBM 5100 to a slightly different worldline, knowing that there are just as many or even more worldlines in which no-one returns to bring back the IBM 5100. It sounds a bit like charity in favour of other worldlines.))
The decisions and actions we take as individuals can only help those who we have direct interaction with. I believe it is wrong to be capable of helping and do nothing. My struggle is in the irony that if everyone just 'did nothing', on every worldline, there would be no action and thus no immorality or evil (no good either).
((I'm very interested in your further comments on the greed of humanity during this time, and perhaps still in your time. You're unique perspective of humanity at this point (2001 and 2036) is valuable. Please share as much thoughts as you can.))
Please feel free to ask anything you like.
((Also, can you record a quick voice message for us before you leave?))
Yes. I am considering trying to videotape my departure and having my parents post it after I leave. That should keep you all busy for a while.
((having lived through the self destruction of the human race, what sort of future do you imagine after 2036? Will humans colonolize and expand through the solar system? Or will we be forever bound to our inward existance, measuring the past, fearfull of the future.))
Keep in mind that not all humans were destroyed but we were all affected. There is a effort going into colonizing space because it is believed that the problems of overpopulation were a large cause of the war. Personally, my generation sees itself as having a duty to try and repair the mess our fathers handed to us. When we were young, most of us had a small taste of the world you live in now and our only dream is to clean it up and give it back to those still able to have children.
Your answers made perfect sense. However, I found another glitch in your "defence".
It's true, if you're able to help someone, you should. By going back to 1975, an infinite number of other worldlines emerge, just because of you coming to 1975. At least half of them undoubtly has "a happy ending", but the other half doesn't. So while helping people on certain worldlines, you're probably making the lifes of people on other worldlines miserable. Just a thought!
Greetings from dry Amsterdam
Roel van Houten
P.S. TimeTravelActivist, you seem to suffer from some form of paranoia. Snap out of it. No offense.
You mentioned in one of your past postings, that your world-Line has established a decentralized form of Independant "Generators" to produce energy for independant dwelling areas since most people occupy "Rural" areas. Could you elaborate more on how this was done?
*What kind of generators are being used to produce your energy?
*How do they work?
*Is there perhaps, any relation of interconnectedness, to our current energy problems being faced on our world-line right now that gave way to pioneer the use of the independant generators being used on your current world-line?
Please read the following, and give us your comments pertaining, and how this makes a connection to the way your world-line operates on.
I would like to point out, that the response met by the power companies in the midst of our current energy crisis in the form of "Rolling Black-Outs" is nothing short, than an act of "Capitalistic Terrorism"
"TAP-TEN Research Foundation To Produce Next Generation Independent Power Generators!"
Conservative approaches by reducing our usage of energy by use of other alternatives such as "Wind, Solar, or other forms of more effective insulation, is very effective, and reduces a customers electric costs, but it again places much financial burdens upon the customer, and is not a consideration to tenants who rent from building owners, that refuse to spend their profits for these upgrades, or those who simply cannot afford these much needed upgrades. Again this process will take many years before it is as common as an ordinary housould appliance.
although conservative use of our demands for power, may teach us to become more resourceful with our energy, it is no "Magic Bullet" in relation to put a stop to the ongoing energy crisis at hand.
Perhaps if our Nation's Hindsight was at best from the beginning, we would have no need for this conversation, but you must not loose sight of what a society that continues to sponsor leaders that support their own interests in the name of economic GREED! (Sorry) but it's much to late in the game to expect this to become the most effective resolution to solve our current(no pun intended) energy crisis, within a given time-frame that would put a stop to this.
In order to put an end to this ongoing problem, you must go directly to the root of the source, or "Sources" that continue to contribute to delaying any actions that would resolve these issues, and one of the most important issues that gives good reason to fight for, that any true Patriot would agree to, is in relation to my "Prior" comments on changing Legislative regulations that quite frankly, "Get in our own way" & "Prohibit" any Alternative energy efficient devices that are non-detrimental to our environment!
The following example below, represents just one, of many examples of "Available" technology that demonstrates an alternative no-detrimental to our Environment to provide us with efficient, non invasive, independent "Power Producing" alternative energy devices.
The Home Of Primordial Energy http://www.depalma.pair.com
Website of the Late Mr. Bruce Depalma
(Scroll down, and click on the "Audio" icon, to listen to a pre-recorded "Interview" from 1997 while Bruce Depalma was alive & well, as he goes into elaborated details, describing his overunity, N-1
" Homopolar electrostatic Generator."
Mr. Bruce Depalma has received a series of International Patent Awards for this Incredible Invention based on Faraday's principles of extracting electricity direct from rotating doughnut shaped magnets counter-rotating with opposing polarity.
...or you may wish to examine various others out there who have been attempting for several years to bring "Alternative" Energy Devices to market through their research. Again, it is not the lack thereof for reasonably sound methods to "REPLACE" our need for fossil fuels, however before any of them can become a reality, we must go direct to the source & attempt to "REPLACE" the ambitious intentions by those leaders whom are fueled by greed, & will stop at nothing to blockade anything that detracts from their kingdoms of centralized power, depending on the oil cartels!
ZERO-POINT FIELD-information on Dr. Haisch's theoretical research into the Zero-Point Field.
FREE ENERGY- Theory- Devices and Progess, A review by Patrick G. Bailey, Ph. D.
REVIEW OF FREE ENERGY EXPERIMENTS--summary review is presented of the experiments and demonstrations that have been reported in the past few years to produce near-unity or over-unity operation.
STIRLING ENGINE-The Stirling engine was invented in 1816 and can use any type of fuel, as well as solar energy.
GEET Releases Technology For FREE! - Paul Pantone founder of Global Environmental Energy Technology recently announced that he would release their "Small Engine Plans" (< 20 HP) for FREE! Plans are now available online. [P>COLD FUSION-a list of links to sources of cold fusion info available on the net.
COLD FUSION TECHNOLOGY-See what the newest research is yielding, and learn the intriguing possibilities of what the future might hold.
ENERGY INFORMATION-Automobiles achieved between 171(1936) and 376(1973) mpg. Yet, government, industry, media and 'environmental groups' say that to achieve 40 mpg an automobile must be downsized.
ELECTRIFYING TIMES-breakthroughs in electric car design are making this mode of transportation more of a feasible reality.
PERFECT SCIENCE AD-has developed a formula to aid in the purification of hydrocarbons. This formula succeeded in breaking the hydrocarbon chain, transforming it into fatty and amino acids. A MUST VISIT SITE.
THREE EXPERIMENTS ON FREE ENERGY-an open letter written to the Space Energy Association, from Harold Aspden.
INSTITUTE FOR NEW ENERGY-Advanced Energy Conversion, New Energy, Free Energy, Zero-Point-Energy, Rotational-Electromagnetics, Earth Electromagnetics, and more.
POLLUTION-FREE Energy Generator -a claim that a perpetual motion device that does not break the first and second laws of thermodynamics has been designed.
FREE ENERGY PAGE-Free Energy Antigravity website by Rick Todish
GYROSCOPIC INERTIAL THRUSTER-This website is a detailed description of a tested and proven "reactionless" inertial propulsion device.
JOSEF HASSLBERGER WEB SITE-an attempt to catalyse energies for change. The economy, physics and technology are in dire need of renewal!
IARC-Ionically Assisted Reaction Cell-a unique fuel cell that could answer our electrical supply problems.
MORE BEARDEN-The Files in this area are produced by T. E. Bearden. The Directories include: The Final Secret of Free Energy with Comment, plus many others.
TESLA COIL-Tesla's best-known invention
LOST INVENTIONS OF TESLA-links to numerous Tesla sites.
TESLA COILS- How they work, with excellent photos.
TESLA'S ELECTRIC CAR!!!-very interesting article from KeelyNet.
TESLA'S Free Energy Receiver-patented in 1901 as An Apparatus for the Utilization of Radiant Energy.
Thank you for your kind words of support. I have just updated my
alternate web site, and another update will come later. You should
visit: <http://ntesla.org>. You may want to bookmark our web site
and watch for updates. We have seven more busts to donate, two of
which are going to the University of Wisconsin and Purdue University.
Also, we are negotiating with Columbia University now. After paying
for these busts our coffer is bare, so we are planning to resume our
T-shirt sales later to earn money for additional busts. We are not
selling them now. Perhaps later you will want to support us by
buying a T-shirt. We hope so because we can use all the help we can
get. Our quest has not been an easy one.
Did you happen to see the PBS documentary on Tesla December 12? If
not, you should watch your TV guide for possible reruns. Stacy
Keach, the Hollywood actor, narrates the voice of Tesla. I recently
received a letter from Stacy who also congratulates us on our work.
We welcome you & your associates to join us, and share your talents to work for our common goal to provide free energy to the world, "In Honour of the Memory of Mr. Nicola Tesla"
TAP-TEN Research Foundation http://Tap-Ten.org
Your use of the english language is, for the lack of a better word "bland". It is very good english, smooth well paced and perhaps more meaningfull and accurate, than I am used to hearing. Better than I can wright myself, in fact. There isn't enough "color" there to make me think your are a professional wrighter, but maybe you could be.
My point is that I don't detect anything in your language use that is "futuristic" or that would peg you down to any particular time or place of up-bringing. I'm far from an expert on the subject, but I'll bet a linguist would have a field day with it.
Question: would your introduction of future language terms, if you used them, have any undesireable effects? Perhaps causing time feed back loops?
In short, you are just too damned logical. We don't get much of that these days.
Trick question: Is George W. W. W. Bush & Co. trying to take over the - - World? I mean if some one were to try and grab ALL the marbles mightent that lead to the war of which you speak?
Thanks for the kind words DaViper!
I believe that we are heading for a
360 degree human evolutionary assention process, and soon enough as the photon belt draws nearer to our solar system we might all embark upon undescribable experienses within the masses that will even be much more difficult for science to explain, let alone "explain away" lest the debunkers of human history reach their final climax of getting themselves "debunked" and to thwart the tyrannic kings of Dark Age tacticts.
It is my contention that there is, and has always been some form of inter-connectedness between the emperical perceptions of Science & Physics, and the Etherical/Esoterical & Religious fields of study in relation to our earliest accounts of human history, dating back to the cradle of civilization in Sumeria & Babylon (which is the oldest known records of earth's human history.)
and it's continued connection to why it is every 3600 yrs that we seem to have mysteriously jumped by quantum leaps into evolution & technological advanvements?
Perhaps things like these, only a Time~Traveller could know for certain.
I'd say on the philosophical level I certainly agree with you.
What's odd, is that on the philosophical level I agree with TT_0 also.
For me, It's really about how we can apply creative thought to solving the problems that have plagued the human race since it's inception.
If we are ever to solve the question of "Time Travel" or any other of the newly aware concepts we face now since we have come technologically this far, it will be through throwing off the old prejudices of the past, having the FAITH in ourselves to do so, and give up the antogonistic ways we have lived by for so many generations.
Frankly, to me, the only "clan" left on Earth is the Human Race. WE ARE IT. And it is time we start viewing ourselves as "Earthlings" instead of Frenchmen, or Americans, or Jews, or Hindus, or White Guys, or Negroes, or Trailer Trash, or Kings.
Hey, WE are the inhabitants of Earth. And it's time for us to start thinking like it.
Timetravel would collapse all speculative markets instantly, because all markets are based on GUESSING what will happen next. It would throw us back into the stone age, or at least as far back as the Clinton era. The horror appalls me, can you immagine having to look at Newt Gringich again?
Next subject. That giant sucking sound you hear? Its the electric grid sucking the life out of the economy. You see y2k didn't work, so now they have to SHUT our power off the hard way.
(PS) what ever you do don't try hiding in the Bushes..... hate to hit and run butttttttttttttttttttttt