The government is monitoring everything you say online and the phone

PRISM

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Jun 10, 2013
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#2
It's been suspected and believed long before the PRISM program became exposed. The recent and developing stories (journalists say there's more coming) give people the long awaited justification to pressure and question the surveillance powers granted by these administrations.
 

Jcpo

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#3
Do you mean NSA ? Echelon program ? Well look around, there are plenty of parables all watching at you. Then watch the sky by night and admire the satellites. Welcome to the new millennium, the war of investigation and information (disinformation)...
 

titorite

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#4
Do you mean NSA ? Echelon program ? Well look around, there are plenty of parables all watching at you. Then watch the sky by night and admire the satellites. Welcome to the new millennium, the war of investigation and information (disinformation)...

This seems like such a silly thing to say.

Maybe you do not live in a nation of law and order. I thought this united states had laws and rules. Procedures that are followed as opposed to double standards that are ignored upon a whim.
 

Jcpo

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#5
This is a much more remarkable problem. It started during wwII and even more during cold war and so the context made the government use this to ensure international trades. Then the bankers and big industrial took the control of the machine and it became unstoppable because they could anticipate any action. Now because of the cold war we live in a half-real world trying to know what is the truth and so they still ensure their control by delivering informations to governments in exchange of some contracts and they also deliver false information to get us lost.

They own the medias, the bourses, the medecine, the military, the entertainement, and a lot of other industries.

They are not lying, they are hidding.

When they say : nobody's listening you .... it is true as it is an automatized program.
Also when they say there is nothing E.T. in the area 51 it is true too, it's in reality located in a smaller area next to it !

Behind the walls there are a lot of puppeteers.
 

Jcpo

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#6
Watch MIB you should be at ease as they are a lot of much more important problem than you. But you must know and convince people. You must search for your origins and open the eyes of the nations to live in a better world where we are not our own enemies. ;)
 

pafjlh

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Mar 16, 2015
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#7
I am not surprised or upset about this in the least. I have already come to realize that we are more connected then ever these days. We also can trace one another more then ever before. Let's face it what I am doing right now being on the Internet on a message board is information anyone can get their hands on about me. All they would need is my ISP address. This is information that the police or the FBI can easily get their hands on. So, it doesn't bother me that the government is monitoring these activities. I have nothing to hide, and maybe some think this is an invasion of privacy but in today's world we really don't have too much privacy left.
 
May 12, 2015
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#8
Never understood the point of this being a surprise to anyone. The WHOLE POINT of intelligence agencies is to gather information... back in the day it was tapping into phone lines and sneaking into buildings, nowadays it's mostly electronic since a large part of communication is electronic too. There is nothing surprising about this, and most countries do this to some extent.

Also keep in mind that it's not actually someone listening to your calls etc. It's just a computer going through and flagging suspicious activity, so you don't really need to worry about someone knowing all your phone conversations. (no one cares about that anyway)
 

kalwhi

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May 11, 2015
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#9
Woha there cowboy!
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/09/u...-jolts-both-defenders-and-reformers.html?_r=0

We've gained a small victory over this, so don't be so down. Since Snowden, I've been been reminding people that the government is watching us constantly. (Well..on Facebook. Every time people got caught up in a new social justice cause I'd be like 'remember how the NSA is watching you and everyone was really upset about THAT not too long ago, and now you're upset about this, and next week, you'll be upset about a new thing')

So, here's what I think and why it's terrifying that the government would have a record of our (as a collective) digital activities:
The internet is: a) a slowly expanding collection of all human knowledge and b) a universal communicative tool that could allow for massive human connection on a wide scale. To the government, this is terrifying anarchy.

The ONLY reason representatives exist is because we, citizens of America, are unable to gather under the same roof and put issues to a vote with the most information available to make an informed decision.
Except, that it's not true anymore. The internet connects us all, and connects us with 'all the facts', so to speak.
So, as the government started making enemies in the world, it started getting paranoid that those enemies could be homegrown.
So, the PATRIOT Act happened after 9/11.
Privacy went away and the NSA was created to combat "terrorism" as the new millennium brought the internet to life as a communication tool, while the government began to keep a close eye on all communication tools.

So, um, er...that's what I think.
(Yay, first post?)
 

vegito12

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May 12, 2015
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#10
It could be done, to see if anyone is doing anything suspicious and try and stop any one who is associated with groups who are working against the country and stop them before they get out of hand. I reckon after the world trade center fell and also how terrorists are shown to be in the country they live in has caused the government to spy on anyone using the computer or even their phone and check them. I think when Edward Snowden revealed what was going on this caused people to be worried and not trust the government as well and worried about privacy as well.
 

Valkyrie

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May 15, 2015
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#11
Wait I thought that it was "carnivore" that was used to monitor the email portions? I guess that had to be soooo yesterday. Well either way I can not say that I am surprised and for the most part I don't really care if someone wants to monitor my activity. Let them go right ahead. If they were really nice they might clear out some of the daily amounts of spam that I get.

To me it is no different then the boss looking over things, my mother checking stuff out or my significant other following me around, I say have at it! You will probably die of boredom. My life is pretty much an open book.
 
May 13, 2015
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#12
It's been suspected and believed long before the PRISM program became exposed. The recent and developing stories (journalists say there's more coming) give people the long awaited justification to pressure and question the surveillance powers granted by these administrations.
At the core of every conspiracy theory is a kernel of truth. Back in the 1990s there was evidence that the NSA had back doored most major software including Windows. In the past the way to combat these allegations would be to deny them. But the modern way to combat these allegations is in my opinion is to have sock puppets create more crazy allegations to divert attention from the original theory.

So with 911, possibly not all of the truth has come out. It distract from this, the CIA etc start releasing crazy theories like a UFO ran into the twin towers or some nonsense like that. This is not to say UFOs do not exist, but just to make the people putting out the theory look crazy.
 

Arvis

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May 17, 2015
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#13
Are they really listening or simply recording and saving your conversations to use them against you just in case?
 
May 13, 2015
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#14
Even though there is overwhelming evidence, anyone who claims it is happening ofcourse is a conspriacy nut. When that does not work they call you a terrorist sympathizer or anti American. And if you make too much noise about it and get actual proof you end up stuck in some 3rd world embassy, or some former soviet block country or thrown in jail.

Somehow exposing things has become anti American. How times change.
 
May 17, 2015
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#15
Not really a conspiracy as this is pretty much known after when edward snowden blew the whistle on such programs and left the country. Honestly I don't care if they do tape what I say or track me, I'm like one person in a country filled with a billion people. Why would they target me for anything as long as I don't do anything suspicious?
 
Oct 10, 2014
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#16
Free market capitalism of too big to fail. Merger of government and corporations = Fascism. The Fed offers credit, credit leads to debt. Debt = bonds. Bonds = contractual bondage. Bondage = slavery/ servitude.

The bond markets began collapsing Thursday morning. Dissolution of bonds = dissolution of bondage = emancipation of the American debt slaves.

It was never about money, your masters can print an infinite amount. This was always about servitude, and the guarantee that you and your children will serve your masters and their children absolutely, forever.
 

Arvis

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#17
Exactly! Even if they are recording and taping everything you say, it probably won't affect you unless you are a spy from Russia or terrorist planning some huge attack. I don't understand the obsession over this topic.
 

ScornedTramp

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Sep 18, 2014
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#18
The point is, if an independant person or people's started rumagging through your mail, or hacked into your personal tech, you would be mad as hell! Yet when the government do it on shakey legal standings everyone just shrugs and let's it happen. Would you let your senator poke around on your hard drive? Or phone? I sure wouldn't.

And who knows what they do and don't see. Or which words and phrases are indicators.

Where's your warrant for this search of private information?

It's a stupid process costing the tax payers a fortune, that yields questionable results and has the potential to undermine every Americans right to freedom.

If I was caught doing this, I would be in jail. But your paying people to literally ignore your rights and spy on potentially every correspondance you make.
 

Gpa

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#19
Free market capitalism of too big to fail. Merger of government and corporations = Fascism. The Fed offers credit, credit leads to debt. Debt = bonds. Bonds = contractual bondage. Bondage = slavery/ servitude.

The bond markets began collapsing Thursday morning. Dissolution of bonds = dissolution of bondage = emancipation of the American debt slaves.

It was never about money, your masters can print an infinite amount. This was always about servitude, and the guarantee that you and your children will serve your masters and their children absolutely, forever.
Again, you have no clue what you are talking about. Why do you keep doing this? Are you purposely trying to mislead, or confuse, or deceive everyone? Or, do you just enjoy displaying your ignorance?
 
Oct 10, 2014
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#20
Again, you have no clue what you are talking about. Why do you keep doing this? Are you purposely trying to mislead, or confuse, or deceive everyone? Or, do you just enjoy displaying your ignorance?
Manipulating the markets by rigging Libor rates and printing money to bail out the bond market institutions is not a free market, nor is it capitalism. It is a merger of state and corporate interests.
 
Oct 10, 2014
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#21
The point is, if an independant person or people's started rumagging through your mail, or hacked into your personal tech, you would be mad as hell! Yet when the government do it on shakey legal standings everyone just shrugs and let's it happen. Would you let your senator poke around on your hard drive? Or phone? I sure wouldn't.

And who knows what they do and don't see. Or which words and phrases are indicators.

Where's your warrant for this search of private information?

It's a stupid process costing the tax payers a fortune, that yields questionable results and has the potential to undermine every Americans right to freedom.

If I was caught doing this, I would be in jail. But your paying people to literally ignore your rights and spy on potentially every correspondance you make.
Several cases of industrial espionage against foreign corporations have resulted in American companies filing patents for the Research and Development of inventions by foreign companies.
 

ScornedTramp

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#22
And I bet those foreign organizations are pretty pissed. Is it any wonder US businesses are being targeted by foreign agencies. But that's another topic.

I live in the UK, but knowing our government, it wouldn't suprise me if they were allowing the US to spy on me too. Germany have been assisting them for a long time now, and the EU is a mess. Your so called leaders are well known for preaching ideals they themselves are happy to contradict, for example torture! And I'm not saying my leaders are any better. Did you see the candidates for our PM? A bunch of fools too concerned with history to focus on effective and decisive change.

The question you guys need to ask is how much more your willing to put up with from a gov. that can't handle any of the serious issues facing us in the future.
 

Gpa

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#23
JudasTitor said:
Manipulating the markets by rigging Libor rates and printing money to bail out the bond market institutions is not a free market, nor is it capitalism. It is a merger of state and corporate interests.
And still, more of the same. What's "libor" rates? If you mean labor rates, they only determin the minimum wage.

JudasTitor said:
Several cases of industrial espionage against foreign corporations have resulted in American companies filing patents for the Research and Development of inventions by foreign companies.
Really... name one.

The question you guys need to ask is how much more your willing to put up with from a gov. that can't handle any of the serious issues facing us in the future.
Hopefully, only until November 8th, 2016.
 

ScornedTramp

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#24
I think most western societies need to push harder for effective change whithin their respective governments. A good start would be to get younger people in and stop letting the older jaded polititians push their out dated agendas on us. An overhaul on the legal system as well, I mean, it's well over due right?
 

rightct

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#25
What would we call it? "Neo"-privacy? Such term doesn't exist, since a huge quantity of information leads to risks. Everything that we say now, and I think that even me typing now are being stored somewhere in this world. We can talk as much as we like about our fundamental risks being trespassed, but we only see the surface of the real things that are being discussed right now about how they could monitor us better. Them listening to our phones is really minuscule compared to what we will see in the future, trust me.
 

Arvis

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#26
I understand what you're trying to say but it honestly doesn't bother me. At all. It's not like someone suddenly is going to expose whatever I do to everyone I know. Also they might record your calls and messages, doesn't mean they listen and read them. If you think about it, yes, they might be violating our rights in terms of law, but what if information they gather is used for a greater good?
 
May 17, 2015
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#28
It's all well & good when outside forces are monitoring you until something is misunderstood & you're arrested for 'thought crimes'. All those searches about how to kill your wife or certain types of porn you may have clicked start to look real horrific at your trial. NYC's 'cannibal cop' is a great example of this. All that information would not have seen the light of day & he probably could care less about being monitored before this happened.
 

Einstein

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#29
I kind of look at it as our government has been taken over and is now run by terrorists. And since war has been declared on terrorists, it is perfectly legal to kill terrorists.
 
Oct 10, 2014
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#30
I kind of look at it as our government has been taken over and is now run by terrorists. And since war has been declared on terrorists, it is perfectly legal to kill terrorists.
All enemies, foreign and domestic? Who enforces the constitution if not the free militia of it's citizens?
 
May 17, 2015
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#31
I tend to think that just because I have nothing to hide (or so I think), that doesn’t mean it shouldn’t bother me. Who knows what little thing could be used against me in a certain circumstance? I guess all I can say is I’m thankful this world isn’t any more like 1984 than it could be.
 
Oct 10, 2014
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#32
I tend to think that just because I have nothing to hide (or so I think), that doesn’t mean it shouldn’t bother me. Who knows what little thing could be used against me in a certain circumstance? I guess all I can say is I’m thankful this world isn’t any more like 1984 than it could be.
What is to stop such agencies from fabricating digital evidence against you?
 

Arvis

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#33
I don't have any faith in those people and I'm pretty sure I will most likely never meet them. So why worry about it?
In my opinion it's a waste of time getting mad about it and you most likely can't change it anyway.
 

ScornedTramp

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#34
My main concern is this; we have a lot of work ahead of us to undo the poor choices of previous generations, and we should be very careful about what we allow to follow us as a generation. Do we want to be remembered as the age of apathy? Throwing away our long held ideals of freedom and self reliance out of fear is not how I want to live. There are more effective ways of dealing with our problems
 

Arvis

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#35
Well, that's another way of looking at it! But how do you expect fighting against this? Of course there could be protests and various events to get some attention, but will it change anything? It's really hard dealing with something as big as this. And perhaps it's a better idea to make your life worth living rather than fighting something you might not be able to beat, get an education, do sports and so on.
 

ScornedTramp

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#36
Its not about fighting an issue, it's about thinking carefully about what's being offered at our expense, and as a society discussing these issues clearly and openly so that we can move forward.
 

Gpa

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#37
I know this makes for a good conspiracy but, what if the facts are;
The only information gathered under this data collection are:
The initiating phone number, IP address
The receiving phone number, IP address
The time and date of the call, e-mail
Which actually "are" the facts under this data collection process.
No content is collected during this step.
Only "if" a number is found to be associated with a known terrorist are any further steps taken to determine "who" in this country was contacted.
 

ScornedTramp

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#38
I've been pretty vocal on this topic, and I can't dispute what your saying. In reality it probably is as benign as we're told. I just find that too many people are either afraid to question governance or simply don't understand the importance of doing so.

World politics has recently become a passion of mine, and the more I research the more dissapointed I am. To have got to 2015 and still be struggling with century old problems even with the knowledge, tools and man power to fix them, it makes me feel a strange mix of anger and sadness
 
May 17, 2015
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#39
I think it’s partly because people aren’t willing to discuss things as groups. Most are too concerned with their individual problems to come together and try to solve collective societal issues. Or they view such issues as too abstract, or not affecting them. Or they simply don’t give it any thought at all.
 

Valkyrie

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#40
I think there is a point with information where you can just have to much. How does one go about sifting through a whole worlds communication and find what is relevant? Sure you can go search terms and words and narrow the list, but even then how much of it is truly relevant?

This makes me think about the web bots back in the 80's and 90's that were suppose to predict the future, I don't know that they did or could, it seemed the design in itself was limited to the information on hand, it is the same with communications collected en masse. I suppose you could find something if you looked long enough, but it is equally as likely that all you would be doing would be trying to make information fit a hypothesis. Perhaps someday it could be valuable for some societal research, but I just fail to see this as an effective crime prevention technique. Pin pointing one loon out of billions of correspondences seems like one heck of a long shot.
 

Gpa

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#42
I think there is a point with information where you can just have to much.
Not to worry. The're making plenty of room.
https://nsa.gov1.info/utah-data-center/


How does one go about sifting through a whole worlds communication and find what is relevant? Sure you can go search terms and words and narrow the list, but even then how much of it is truly relevant?
Let's see.
Generic US phone number.. 321-555-1234 belonging to an unknown person.
Generic Foreign phone number (020) 1234 4321 belonging to a known terrorist.
(London-ish I think. Milo.X. can offer a better example but this serves to illustrate my point)
Phone numbers for calls from overseas into the US are collected as well as the number called.
This goes into a data set.
When the phone number of a confirmed or suspected terrorist is learned, this data set is searched for any occurrence of that number calling INTO the US. Fast computers...no big deal.
If it comes up in the search, the number that was called, IN THE US, is looked at more closely. I would consider that "probable case".
Any calls "from that" US number, either back overseas, or domestically, are also fair game to be looked at.
Since data has been collected for all calls the data set contains a history of that information that can be looked at. Without that "history", if the US number has since been discarded, determining "accomplices" would be difficult if not impossible. Instead, the tracks of others can be followed.
Ok, so what if the number in the US was a mis-dial? Maybe there is a protocol to determine that. Only one call, see who owns the US number. Is the number still active? Has it received any more calls from this or any other suspect non-US number? No, set it to the side...but keep an eye on it. Yes, get wiretap orders and go to town on it.
The same holds for data collection overseas. Collect it...if and when it is needed...use it to find bad guys.
ALL of the other calls will be in a storage device and NO ONE will ever bother to look at it...UNLESS you become a bad guy.
NO ONE is LISTENING to EVERY frickin call that is being made. There are not enough people in the world to do that. It's ridiculous.

Ok, back to your favorite conspiracy theory. Hope I didn't spoil it for you by telling you the ending.
 

Travelist

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#44
Well, private networks and encrypted traffic is what you need for not let thirdy party strangers bump into your busniess. There are a quite good amount of tutorials and video tutorials about it. Tor network is an exmaple of this protection you can use, just download the browser and you're in and I guess pretty none will know what you're doing (unless you're NSA :p)
 

Gpa

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#45
What is the bad guy? The guy responsible for the murder of 100,000 women and children in Iraq?
Yea, he was one of the bad guys. He stood trial and was hanged for it. Good ending for him.

 
Likes: walt

DulceBASS

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#47
When I was in high school, there was some hubbub about the Total Information Awareness program which was likely the proposed precursor to PRISM. I wrote a letter to my senator about how it troubled me. He swore to me that the government would never ever violate its citizens privacy in such an extreme way. I didn't exactly feel good about the letter I got back but I do think it's funny that it basically happened. I wonder how aware the legislative branch was before these programs were put into place. I don't necessarily think they would have much to stop them but I would like to know who knew what and when they knew.

It's just so troubling because I've heard of some shady things the government has done with some of the information. I read an article about how intelligence agencies were using the porn habits of suspected terrorists to try and shame them in their communities and organizations. It's not a stretch to think that sort of thing could happen against normal citizens suspected of a crime. I'm sure they could do much worse as well.